IntersectionAllies: Interview with the Authors
“We thought it was really important to introduce this concept of intersectionality, through the book, because it’s a really important way of helping us build empathy, show compassion, and just help each other, just know one another and better understand one another. ”
We were fortunate enough to have the opportunity to sit down with the authors of one of our favorite books - IntersectionAllies. (We also happen to house this and many others in our Little Free Antiracist Libraries.) Steeped in deep academic research and inspiration from what the authors like to call their “Academic Aunties,” this book holds lessons for all ages about how to be an ally across the intersection of so many searingly human characteristics.
As part of our weekly Sunday Storytime series, we select a new book from our collection to read aloud. We were thrilled when we were connected to the authors of this beautiful book to do a reading and sit down with us for some Q & A too. Here’s a transcript from that conversation, which has inspired us to no end.
Jenny from RUAR (Interviewer): We are so excited to have the authors of IntersectionAllies, one of our 21 books for 2021. They are here to read their beautiful book, and to chat with us a bit as well. IntersectionAllies is definitely a favorite book in my house, and we are thrilled to be including it in our new 21 books for 2021 additions to our Little Free Antiracist Libraries that we have built throughout Northern California. And with this reading, we're able to share it with even more people who may not have the ability to come visit one of our libraries in person. Chelsea, LaToya and Carolyn, welcome. We are so happy to have you here. Why don't we start off by having you guys introduce yourselves and in the spirit of gratitude, to share one thing you are grateful for today?
Chelsea Johnson, Author IntersectionAllies: Hi, I'm Chelsea Johnson. I am a Chicagoland native currently living in Minneapolis. I work as a user experience researcher in tech now studying things like trust. So it's really fun to think about how Intersectionality can manifest and inform the technologies that we work with every day. And speaking of things that we're grateful for, I'm so thankful that we have things like Zoom to be able to connect together and really keep the work going, even despite all these trying times. I am excited to bring IntersectionAllies here today through Dottir Press, our publisher, by feminists for everyone, so thanks to them.
LaToya Council, Author IntersectionAllies: I'm so happy and excited to be here with you all. My name is LaToya Council. And I'm currently finishing up my PhD in Sociology and Gender Studies at the University of Southern California. A little bit about me, I call myself the love doctor. Because I study relationships, and how couples manage everything. Work, family, and romantic dynamics is something that I'm grateful for and the unity that we're seeing amongst people across groups in the US and around the world. It really gives me hope that our future is going to be in great hands.
Carolyn Choi, Author IntersectionAllies: Nice to meet you all. My name is Carolyn Choi. And I am born and raised and currently living in Los Angeles, the City of Angels. I am also a Ph.D. student at USC studying Sociology, and Gender Studies. My research looks at education, immigration, gender, across the global north and the global south. I've been able to travel to many different countries to do my research. That experience has definitely allowed me to bring a lot of insights and ideas to the book. I'm just grateful for the opportunity to share the book with you guys, and to be together here today.
Jenny: You published this book in the summer of 2019. And since then, obviously, so much has changed and probably much more than anyone could have predicted at that time. As you all reflect on writing this super important book, what did you originally intend for the most important takeaway to be? And how do you think that has changed based on where we are today?
Carolyn: This book was written after the Women's March, where all of us had protested, and been involved in the marches. And so it was really important for us at the time to be able to have our experiences represented, which with mainstream feminist discourses, it's often intersectional issues and woman of color issues have often been sidelined. So we created this book, and we came together to be able to see ourselves in each other and in the characters. This is one of the biggest struggles we have of today, and in the current moment. Society is increasingly polarized and distressful. We thought it was really important to introduce this concept of intersectionality, through the book, because it's a really important way of helping us build empathy, show compassion, and just help each other, just know one another and better understand one another. The moral of the book is that even though we recognize that we each have different parts of us that make us different, we can also really come together because we share a lot of aspects that are meaningful to us, in addition to having aspects that are different. One of the cool things about the book, at the time, we had created it with all-girl characters. And often we get the question, why don't we have boy characters? Well, we did a lot of readings in elementary schools during the beginning of our book tour, and we never really had an issue with boys saying that they're not represented or where are the boy characters because they're always seeing themselves in the stories of the characters. And so boys and girls were both really excited about seeing bilingual kids, about seeing kids who are helping their families, friends being there for each other. And so, this book is largely about that.
LaToya: And to add to what Carolyn just said, about boys in the classroom, and them not really bringing that up. We're hinting at another takeaway is this idea of making room which is all over the book, right? It's in the title, it's everywhere, and to plug Dr. Marie Hancock Alfaro, who wrote the letters to parents in the book, making room asks for positive action from us, rather than a minimal response. Essentially what we're saying is, in order for you to gain an ally, you must first be an ally, which takes initiative, cooperation, and trustworthiness. And so we need to ask people, what do they need from us? And how do they want us to show up in their life? And importantly, when do they need us to be quiet and just listen?
Chelsea: Adding on, there weren't very many books like this when it came out in the summer of 2019. And we also sort of expected it to be this nice book that people would find if they were looking for it - that certainly was the case at the time. But what we found was that it was able to meet the moment as broader consciousness started thinking about and really reckoning with issues around race and power and class, that the pandemic really brought to light in a new way and to the forefront of conversations. So it ended up, not that our lessons and takeaway changed, but the context of the book was sitting in change, and ended up reaching so many more people. So I feel really grateful that we were able to meet the moment. IntersectionAllies is also one of very few books for kids that depicts realistic depictions of protest. And I think people were really looking to close the gap between what kids were seeing on TV and how to talk to them about it. So it was cool that we were there to meet that moment. I'd say the one thing that has really changed, is that we were able to add to the Teaching Guide Companion, an emphasis on self-care. The concept of self-care comes from activist communities, and it's so important. Now, as you know, so many people are lonely, or struggling, or facing grief in different ways. I think that emphasis was super important, and it's become more and more important to talk about as time goes on.
Jenny: That is such a great point around self-care for kids and adults - of people of all ages. This book was already going to be important, but now more than ever, for families to be able to have conversations with their children about race, about being an ally about all different kinds of people and making room is such an important message and this is a great way to introduce that message to kids. A second question that I have for you guys is what advice would you give to kids for how to be a strong ally for their friends and classmates? And what are some examples of action or language?
LaToya: It is so important to teach kids how to be an ally. The first way that children, kids, young adults, and even adults can be allies is that differences should not be feared. When we say in the book, we strive to be equal, but not all the same. What we're saying is, we should embrace differences we shouldn't fear differences - we should accept differences. And understand that being an ally and making room for others across differences is important. It's empowering. As we mentioned earlier, it's important to ask people how they want to be helped and referred to. One of the best examples that we can come up with, among many, is pronouns. We have the character Kate, for example, who is non-binary. They go by they/them pronouns. Instead of assuming someone goes by she, her, hers, or he, him, his, ask them. “Hey, what are your personal pronouns?” That's a conversation that many schools are having with children today, and many adults need to be having that conversation in their workplaces, in their friends circles, and not assume that they know people's pronouns. That's a great way that kids can be allies. Another part about being an ally that we sometimes might not talk about a lot is this idea of making mistakes. We're humans. A part of being a good human, a good citizen, is recognizing we make mistakes, assessing that we make those mistakes, and then apologizing, and committing it to memory. Okay, next time, I'm going to try to do a little bit better. I didn't get the pronouns right this time, but next time, I'm going to ask again first, because people like that, or I'm going to commit it to memory. Maybe I need to write it down. So don't be hard on yourself. Being an ally takes repetition. Again, plugging Dr. Marie Hancock Alfaro who wrote the letter to grownups, which is amazing. It takes repetition and with practice, and with time, we just get better at it. So I hope that helps people see how they can help kids learn how to be an ally.
Jenny: Those are some amazing tips, and they're just so practical. I love all the examples that you gave and, to your point, it's not just kids, it's definitely people of all ages who need practice and need to also give themselves grace for making mistakes but apologize for them. The last question for you: We love seeing all the books that you are inspired by in the back of this book. And we too, have been inspired by so many of these books and authors. We actually include a bunch of these books in our Little Free Antiracist Libraries, like Sister Outsider. We'd love to hear from each of you on what one book has most recently inspired you the most and why.
Chelsea: I've been rereading Solidarity Politics for Millennials, by Ange-Marie Hancock. The reason why I find it super impactful for me in this moment is because we're often thinking about and trying to get around oppression Olympics, and comparing our struggles to other people. Also comparing our activism and allyship to other people. The book is such an incredible reminder that solidarity is important and striving to understand across our differences is important. This book is Solidarity Politics for Millennials, but thinking about intersectionality. In the conversations we have around the book, we're often talking to millennial parents. And so it's kind of a way of connecting the dots between things that Academic Aunties have said and how we can continue that message and follow in their footsteps.
LaToya: So my favorite book that I've been reading is Invisible Families by Dr. Mignon Moore, who's a chair at Barnard and affiliated with Columbia, and she does great work on looking at Black lesbian moms and how they handle work and family life and what it means to be a mother and the challenges when you look at same-sex families from an intersectional perspective, which actually is a great way. Not only is it a great book, personally, she's an Academic Auntie, a mentor for me. But she's also someone who's inspiring our second book, which is looking at intersectional families and looking at the meaning of family, as it looks at the intersections of our race, or sexuality, immigration status, so on and so forth. That book is something that should be in people's libraries. And I think it's important and stay tuned because IntersectionAllies will be talking about intersectional families in 2022.
Carolyn: So many books! There are a lot of books that I'm reading currently, but I've also been rereading some of the classics too. Those are the books that have inspired this book and IntersectionAllies too. So out of them, I like Borderlands by Gloria Anzaldúa because that was a book that I encountered in college and my gender studies and Asian American Studies classes, Ethnic Studies classes. Before Intersectionality was introduced as a term by Dr. Kimberle Crenshaw, to look at the legal context. It was very core to how women of color have been narrating their experiences that were largely invisible. This was a book that showed me the gateway for that. It's a collection of essays, memoirs, and poetry, which I love to read. It talks about seeing a new consciousness and how borders are artificial. It really shows us what it means to be multiple identities and how to coexist and be all of these things that make us, us, at once. I feel like a lot of these classic books have been leading the conversation to be able to talk about all of our experiences now. And it's influenced a lot of great books that are out there today.
Jenny: Anything else you guys want to add or say before we sign off?
Chelsea: We just want to say thank you so much for inviting us here. This was a really incredible conversation and also just so great to meet you. Thank you so much for the opportunity. I'm on a high just meeting new people and having another trio meet this trio and supporting each other. It feels so great.
Jenny: We're so happy to make the connection. Hopefully one day, someday in the far future, we will get to meet in person or over another zoom. Thank you so much, Chelsea, LaToya, and Carolyn for joining us. We are so happy to share this reading. We are so excited about your next book as well, so we'll be staying tuned for that.
Teaching Resources for IntersectionAllies
To download the Teaching Resources referenced in this article, go to https://www.dottirpress.com/intersectionallies-teaching-guide.
Find IntersectionAllies in any of our Little Free Antiracist Libraries in Walnut Creek, or our new library in Burlingame, California.